As per usual with these things, all cancelling Spotify did was hurt independent artists, whose friends and fans suddenly said, "oh sorry, yeah, I can't stream your new album because I'm engaging in a totally useless and ineffective protest against Joe Rogan. Sorry 'bout that." Gee, thanks, friend....
Neil Young left in January of 2022. His “boycott” had little to no effect at Spotify, nor would this have substantially dealt a blow to Indy artists. They should have received more streams from whatever music service everyone went to that would have paid the artist at a higher rate than Spotify (looking at you Apple, Tidal, etc).
What’s really fun - if you follow the link below - Spotify added to their subscriber base in Q1 2022 while revenue dipped, which appears cyclical.
"nor would this have substantially dealt a blow to Indy artists" -- I'm not quite sure I'm interpreting this statement correctly, but anything that discourages a hard-fought-for and already limited base of fans and friends from listening to an independent artist's work deals a blow. It's not a direct financial blow -- no one other than a rarified few artists/songwriters make any money at all on Spotify. It's an arguably more important kind of damage when an indie artist's fans put some meaningless boycott over their ability to support an indie artist -- it's a blow of morale, frustration, discouragement and isolation.
And on a practical level, a lack of ongoing access to streaming an indie artist's work as part of their regular music listening habits means less awareness of that artist, less interest in their tours and merchandise, and, again most importantly, less opportunity for the music created with such love and care to find its way to an audience.
I'm saying this from the experience of having released on LP on Spotify while this was happening and the frustration and disappointment that came from friends refusing to be supportive in the name of whatever the hell they were trying to prove with their "boycott."
Hell yes on World Party. "Way Down Now" is one of the rare songs that will improve my mood no matter how dark it is. When the outro solo starts and the Sympathy "Whoo hoo" vox kick in, I can't help but smile. We were fortunate to see World Party when they resumed touring around 2014 -- they were brilliant and Karl was grateful and joyful. Enjoy your trip through the universe, you brilliant man.
Great read as always. I love how balanced and pragmatic your reasoning is. What bothered me the most about Young's initial stance was the virtue signalling, and the "it's him or me" melodrama. You hit the nail in the head when you talk about competition. And I would add, not only in terms of platforms/channels, but audience. Young's miscalculation was thinking people would follow him blindly just because he is Neil Young. Trying to silence other voices is never wise. You just got to work harder so people listen to (and hear) you more, not stifle others who also have an audience and some leverage. Happy weekend!
Thank you, Andy! And I'm 100% with you; he banked on the idea that "all or nothing" decisions still exist in the 2020s. They sometimes do, but it should've been pretty clear pretty quickly that not when it comes to streaming.
Aside from the obvious differences, I can’t help but parallel the Spotify issue with the recent Substack issue…
Totally going to listen to the podcast on Blister in the Sun! I’m going to see Violent Femmes in Peoria and sooooo excited!!! They were rumored to be working on a show here in Davenport, but apparently that didn’t work out and I was so bummed! But, Peoria is “driving home after the concert” distance unlike Chicago (now that I’m no longer in my early 20s lol).
The article on the bar was a great read! Weird to see the building collapse from Davenport having some wider effect. Totally understandable though. I have two friends that were living there. One had an extensive vinyl collection with a lot of rares that he just lost - for obvious reasons people were not allowed back in the building to get any belongings. The two record stores here donated some to him and a few people organized some specific vinyl benefits for him.
Well, well, well, woulda ya look at that #1 song? Not my favorite 'mats song, but I'll take it.
RE: Mellencamp & Springsteen, I have been reading some grousing about how John appears disengaged, almost irritated, that he is performing. Not here, but there was a lot of fanfare around Springsteen stopping by while he was out running an errand for Patti.
When has John Mellencamp ever presented himself as Mr. Happy Go Lucky? And no one has ever called him a "ray of sunshine." He is, by his admission, his children's, ex-wives, bandmates, and friends, cantankerous (and that's being kind). That's part of who he is. You either appreciate it, or you don't. Let's not forget that the man's nickname was (might still be) "Little Bastard." And if you don't appreciate those things about him, I wouldn't suggest going to the show. He's an artist in every sense, and, ya know, maybe mustering the energy to play "Hurts So Good" for the billionth time may be challenging. That being said, his most recent setlist is pretty hits-heavy. His songwriting is Springsteen-adjacent... not his disposition.
I'm a fan of both artists (and agree 100% with you on The Replacements track). I'm a Mellencamp fan in part because he is a "Little Bastard" who's not afraid to speak his mind. Does that mean I want to hang out with him? Nope, but I appreciate that he hasn't tried to morph into someone different in pursuit of a hit.
When the Spotify/Young debate first occurred, I wrote a "Music Diaries" essay about it, making several of the same points you mention here. After seeing your excellent take, I went back and reread/updated it with a postscript. Would be curious to see what you and others think.
Agreed. I think a coalition of sorts could've moced the needle. As much as I like the idea of one man taking on the company, it was never going to be a winning battle.
That Billboard Modern Rock chart toppers from 1989 is so amazing! The Wonder Stuff, XTC, one of my fave Elvis Costello songs ever, and on and on. Where do you find this remarkable treasure my friend?!
P.S. Was never super into Neil Young, but certainly people should be able to evolve their stance on important issues based on how events unfold over the course of months to a couple of years, without being eviscerated by armchair anarchists. That's my take! I like both Spotify and Amazon Music for the record.
Hey, Neil, you have more money than 99.9% of indie artists who need help engaging even a limited audience on any digital platform. If people don't like Rogan, don't listen to him. It reminds me of the blowback Howard Stern faced from people who didn't like his FM radio show. Turn the dial. Next...
I think Taylor Swift may be the only artist who has the power to be able to make Spotify change practice. If she threatened to leave the platform, it would be significantly more worrisome for them than Neil Young's exit. She also could have been more forceful with her pushback against Ticketmaster if she wanted to, but she didn't.
I think you're right. In fact, I'm not sure I could come up with anyone else that comes close to being able to move a mountain like that. Beyonce maybe, and the BTS stan army, but that's it--and I'm not sure either of those could pull it off.
Really good post! Especially mentions of Pere Ubu and Violent Femmes.
Competition won't stop stupid arrogant disinformation like Joe Rogan's podcast from streaming. Just like it won't stop UFC, WWE, or Donald J. Trump. We have a population that hasn't been taught to think. Intellectualism is ridiculed. Reading a book is a bad thing (so ban them or burn them).
I practice Zen. Right thinking is critical thinking. It's about not making rash decisions and dealing with consequences. Maybe people should follow the Eight-Fold Path and not take everything so literally.
Sorry for the rant. Joe Rogan bugs the shit out of me, and having Dr. Phil as a guest spouting anti-immigrant lies was shocking (and hilarious on The Daily Show).
I know I already repsonded on Notes, but worth reiterating that rants like this are always welcome here, and that I will never miss a chance to work in some Pere Ubu. :)
I appreciate Young's attempt to stand on principle--I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt here--but this was also an exercise in ego flexing. Nobody paying attention should be surprised by this outcome.
Really excellent piece of commentary. You're pretty good at this. 😉
As per usual with these things, all cancelling Spotify did was hurt independent artists, whose friends and fans suddenly said, "oh sorry, yeah, I can't stream your new album because I'm engaging in a totally useless and ineffective protest against Joe Rogan. Sorry 'bout that." Gee, thanks, friend....
Neil Young left in January of 2022. His “boycott” had little to no effect at Spotify, nor would this have substantially dealt a blow to Indy artists. They should have received more streams from whatever music service everyone went to that would have paid the artist at a higher rate than Spotify (looking at you Apple, Tidal, etc).
What’s really fun - if you follow the link below - Spotify added to their subscriber base in Q1 2022 while revenue dipped, which appears cyclical.
Referenced above: https://www.businessofapps.com/data/spotify-statistics/
"nor would this have substantially dealt a blow to Indy artists" -- I'm not quite sure I'm interpreting this statement correctly, but anything that discourages a hard-fought-for and already limited base of fans and friends from listening to an independent artist's work deals a blow. It's not a direct financial blow -- no one other than a rarified few artists/songwriters make any money at all on Spotify. It's an arguably more important kind of damage when an indie artist's fans put some meaningless boycott over their ability to support an indie artist -- it's a blow of morale, frustration, discouragement and isolation.
And on a practical level, a lack of ongoing access to streaming an indie artist's work as part of their regular music listening habits means less awareness of that artist, less interest in their tours and merchandise, and, again most importantly, less opportunity for the music created with such love and care to find its way to an audience.
I'm saying this from the experience of having released on LP on Spotify while this was happening and the frustration and disappointment that came from friends refusing to be supportive in the name of whatever the hell they were trying to prove with their "boycott."
It's frustrating, but once a natural monopoly like Spotify occurs, there's pretty much no resisting the only real marketplace on the planet.
Frustrating indeed!
Love the Modern Rock chart!
Hell yes on World Party. "Way Down Now" is one of the rare songs that will improve my mood no matter how dark it is. When the outro solo starts and the Sympathy "Whoo hoo" vox kick in, I can't help but smile. We were fortunate to see World Party when they resumed touring around 2014 -- they were brilliant and Karl was grateful and joyful. Enjoy your trip through the universe, you brilliant man.
Yes!! The Modern Rock chart holds so many of my dears!!!
Also huge fan of World Party, and love this track!
That song is guaranteed to make me at least 5% happier. Every time.
Great read as always. I love how balanced and pragmatic your reasoning is. What bothered me the most about Young's initial stance was the virtue signalling, and the "it's him or me" melodrama. You hit the nail in the head when you talk about competition. And I would add, not only in terms of platforms/channels, but audience. Young's miscalculation was thinking people would follow him blindly just because he is Neil Young. Trying to silence other voices is never wise. You just got to work harder so people listen to (and hear) you more, not stifle others who also have an audience and some leverage. Happy weekend!
Thank you, Andy! And I'm 100% with you; he banked on the idea that "all or nothing" decisions still exist in the 2020s. They sometimes do, but it should've been pretty clear pretty quickly that not when it comes to streaming.
Aside from the obvious differences, I can’t help but parallel the Spotify issue with the recent Substack issue…
Totally going to listen to the podcast on Blister in the Sun! I’m going to see Violent Femmes in Peoria and sooooo excited!!! They were rumored to be working on a show here in Davenport, but apparently that didn’t work out and I was so bummed! But, Peoria is “driving home after the concert” distance unlike Chicago (now that I’m no longer in my early 20s lol).
The article on the bar was a great read! Weird to see the building collapse from Davenport having some wider effect. Totally understandable though. I have two friends that were living there. One had an extensive vinyl collection with a lot of rares that he just lost - for obvious reasons people were not allowed back in the building to get any belongings. The two record stores here donated some to him and a few people organized some specific vinyl benefits for him.
Oh nice! I'm sorry to hear your friend lost everything, but I love that the community stepped up to help replace his collection.
Well, well, well, woulda ya look at that #1 song? Not my favorite 'mats song, but I'll take it.
RE: Mellencamp & Springsteen, I have been reading some grousing about how John appears disengaged, almost irritated, that he is performing. Not here, but there was a lot of fanfare around Springsteen stopping by while he was out running an errand for Patti.
When has John Mellencamp ever presented himself as Mr. Happy Go Lucky? And no one has ever called him a "ray of sunshine." He is, by his admission, his children's, ex-wives, bandmates, and friends, cantankerous (and that's being kind). That's part of who he is. You either appreciate it, or you don't. Let's not forget that the man's nickname was (might still be) "Little Bastard." And if you don't appreciate those things about him, I wouldn't suggest going to the show. He's an artist in every sense, and, ya know, maybe mustering the energy to play "Hurts So Good" for the billionth time may be challenging. That being said, his most recent setlist is pretty hits-heavy. His songwriting is Springsteen-adjacent... not his disposition.
I'm a fan of both artists (and agree 100% with you on The Replacements track). I'm a Mellencamp fan in part because he is a "Little Bastard" who's not afraid to speak his mind. Does that mean I want to hang out with him? Nope, but I appreciate that he hasn't tried to morph into someone different in pursuit of a hit.
100% agree!!!
Not my favorite either, but I do love it.
That Billboard chart!
When the Spotify/Young debate first occurred, I wrote a "Music Diaries" essay about it, making several of the same points you mention here. After seeing your excellent take, I went back and reread/updated it with a postscript. Would be curious to see what you and others think.
https://open.substack.com/pub/glenncook/p/loose-ends-spotify-and-neil-young?r=727x&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
Thanks for the link! I'll read on my lunch break today (3/18).
Neil Young isn't big enough to move the needle on Spotify by himself. Probably no one is.
But lets say Neil Young, Paul McCartney, Bob Dylan, and Robert Plant all pulled their stuff in lock step. That might have gotten somewhere.
Agreed. I think a coalition of sorts could've moced the needle. As much as I like the idea of one man taking on the company, it was never going to be a winning battle.
Thing Festival! Probably won’t go this year, but they did move it from across the Puget Sound in Port Townsend to the Eastside.
Thanks for the Gordon again podcast link. Started listening to it this morning!
Really enjoyed this. Thanks for making it available to everyone. Now considering paid subscription!
I'm glad you enjoyed it, Lou!
That Billboard Modern Rock chart toppers from 1989 is so amazing! The Wonder Stuff, XTC, one of my fave Elvis Costello songs ever, and on and on. Where do you find this remarkable treasure my friend?!
P.S. Was never super into Neil Young, but certainly people should be able to evolve their stance on important issues based on how events unfold over the course of months to a couple of years, without being eviscerated by armchair anarchists. That's my take! I like both Spotify and Amazon Music for the record.
I'm terminally online. Once in awhile, I find some gold. lol.
Hey, Neil, you have more money than 99.9% of indie artists who need help engaging even a limited audience on any digital platform. If people don't like Rogan, don't listen to him. It reminds me of the blowback Howard Stern faced from people who didn't like his FM radio show. Turn the dial. Next...
Exactly!
I think Taylor Swift may be the only artist who has the power to be able to make Spotify change practice. If she threatened to leave the platform, it would be significantly more worrisome for them than Neil Young's exit. She also could have been more forceful with her pushback against Ticketmaster if she wanted to, but she didn't.
I think you're right. In fact, I'm not sure I could come up with anyone else that comes close to being able to move a mountain like that. Beyonce maybe, and the BTS stan army, but that's it--and I'm not sure either of those could pull it off.
Really good post! Especially mentions of Pere Ubu and Violent Femmes.
Competition won't stop stupid arrogant disinformation like Joe Rogan's podcast from streaming. Just like it won't stop UFC, WWE, or Donald J. Trump. We have a population that hasn't been taught to think. Intellectualism is ridiculed. Reading a book is a bad thing (so ban them or burn them).
I practice Zen. Right thinking is critical thinking. It's about not making rash decisions and dealing with consequences. Maybe people should follow the Eight-Fold Path and not take everything so literally.
Sorry for the rant. Joe Rogan bugs the shit out of me, and having Dr. Phil as a guest spouting anti-immigrant lies was shocking (and hilarious on The Daily Show).
Peace!
I know I already repsonded on Notes, but worth reiterating that rants like this are always welcome here, and that I will never miss a chance to work in some Pere Ubu. :)
I listened to "The Modern Dance" after reading your post and it still rocks. A terrific garage-punk avant-garde album. "Merdre Merdre!"
I appreciate Young's attempt to stand on principle--I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt here--but this was also an exercise in ego flexing. Nobody paying attention should be surprised by this outcome.
Really excellent piece of commentary. You're pretty good at this. 😉
Thank you, Eric!